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	<title>Comments on: SquirrelFish is faster than Tamarin</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/</link>
	<description>charles ying's blog about art, music, and the art of technology</description>
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		<title>By: of</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-10705</link>
		<dc:creator>of</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Sep 2009 07:43:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-10705</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;And there By, wonderful way for?Some features in, things ? unless.Article I want, important as it.Can turn the of, push ==&gt; If causes writers block.This concept is, much cash they.,&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And there By, wonderful way for?Some features in, things ? unless.Article I want, important as it.Can turn the of, push ==&gt; If causes writers block.This concept is, much cash they.,</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ajax for the Real World :: Browser JavaScript performance leapfrogged again</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-10152</link>
		<dc:creator>Ajax for the Real World :: Browser JavaScript performance leapfrogged again</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 00:09:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-10152</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;[...] JavaScript interpreter, providing a huge boost to JavaScript performance that actually put Safari ahead of Tamarin, the JavaScript engine used in Adobe [...]&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] JavaScript interpreter, providing a huge boost to JavaScript performance that actually put Safari ahead of Tamarin, the JavaScript engine used in Adobe [...]</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Performance web &#187; SquirrelFish dans WebKit</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9822</link>
		<dc:creator>Performance web &#187; SquirrelFish dans WebKit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Sep 2008 14:38:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9822</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;[...] moteur de script de Flash 9, Tamarin, donné par Adboe/Macromedia au projet Mozilla. Le travail sur les performances n&#8217;est pas encore aussi abouti, mais on peut tout de même prévoir de bonnes choses pour le [...]&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] moteur de script de Flash 9, Tamarin, donné par Adboe/Macromedia au projet Mozilla. Le travail sur les performances n&#8217;est pas encore aussi abouti, mais on peut tout de même prévoir de bonnes choses pour le [...]</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Sandy</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9724</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:43:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9724</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Looks like TraceMonkey is now faster than SquirrelFish on the whole.  Yay competition!&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;http://www.masonchang.com/2008/08/tracemonkey-vs-squirrelfish.html&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looks like TraceMonkey is now faster than SquirrelFish on the whole.  Yay competition!</p>

<p><a href="http://www.masonchang.com/2008/08/tracemonkey-vs-squirrelfish.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.masonchang.com/2008/08/tracemonkey-vs-squirrelfish.html</a></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: CityBlog &#124; Safari 4 farà tremare Firefox?</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9620</link>
		<dc:creator>CityBlog &#124; Safari 4 farà tremare Firefox?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:59:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9620</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;[...] campo dell&#8217;ottimizzazione delle macchine virtuali.  Secondo i primi benchmark, SquirrelFish è quasi il doppio più veloce di Tamarin, il motore JavaScript alla base di Flash 9 e delle future versioni di Firefox, e il 46% [...]&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] campo dell&#8217;ottimizzazione delle macchine virtuali.  Secondo i primi benchmark, SquirrelFish è quasi il doppio più veloce di Tamarin, il motore JavaScript alla base di Flash 9 e delle future versioni di Firefox, e il 46% [...]</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Maciej Stachowiak</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9619</link>
		<dc:creator>Maciej Stachowiak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 09:10:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9619</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@David Temkin&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Got a pointer to the application level tests you are trying? OpenLaszlo sounds like an interesting tool for performance testing since we can compare directly to Flash for functionally similar things.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Also, if you are generating native classes for AS, then isn&#039;t that typed code?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;In general though I&#039;d love to profile a heads-up comparison of an app-level benchmark and see if the time is in rendering or script execution or something else surprising.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@David Temkin</p>

<p>Got a pointer to the application level tests you are trying? OpenLaszlo sounds like an interesting tool for performance testing since we can compare directly to Flash for functionally similar things.</p>

<p>Also, if you are generating native classes for AS, then isn&#8217;t that typed code?</p>

<p>In general though I&#8217;d love to profile a heads-up comparison of an app-level benchmark and see if the time is in rendering or script execution or something else surprising.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Oliver</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9618</link>
		<dc:creator>Oliver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 08:26:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9618</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@gfan: ah, i thought i&#039;d replied to you before (i did on the webkit blog).  In the commandline version of sunspider it is possible for sunspider to remove absolutely all computation time (lexing, parsing, compilation) as sunspider gets the time before and after calling &quot;load(somescript)&quot;.  In the browser that&#039;s not completely possible as you can&#039;t control network latency, so the tests have to calculate start and end times themselves.  Unfortunately this means the the outermost (global code) will have been compiled, and all the code will have been &lt;em&gt;parsed&lt;/em&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Two important things to note though are: parsing takes basically 0% of the runtime -- you can add fairly significant amounts of additional work to the parser without causing any change in sunspider (although one would hope you were making such changes to enable improvements later :D ).  As for the compilation of the global code segment, there is only one test that actually performs the majority of its computation in the global scope and that has a very small amount of code relative to its runtime, so there should not be any significant impact from this.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Finally, even though we do discount the compile time for a very small portion of the tests, profiling (at least in squirrelfish) shows that less than 0.3% of the execution time is spent generating the bytecode, so it really is not significant.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@gfan: ah, i thought i&#8217;d replied to you before (i did on the webkit blog).  In the commandline version of sunspider it is possible for sunspider to remove absolutely all computation time (lexing, parsing, compilation) as sunspider gets the time before and after calling &#8220;load(somescript)&#8221;.  In the browser that&#8217;s not completely possible as you can&#8217;t control network latency, so the tests have to calculate start and end times themselves.  Unfortunately this means the the outermost (global code) will have been compiled, and all the code will have been <em>parsed</em>.</p>

<p>Two important things to note though are: parsing takes basically 0% of the runtime &#8212; you can add fairly significant amounts of additional work to the parser without causing any change in sunspider (although one would hope you were making such changes to enable improvements later :D ).  As for the compilation of the global code segment, there is only one test that actually performs the majority of its computation in the global scope and that has a very small amount of code relative to its runtime, so there should not be any significant impact from this.</p>

<p>Finally, even though we do discount the compile time for a very small portion of the tests, profiling (at least in squirrelfish) shows that less than 0.3% of the execution time is spent generating the bytecode, so it really is not significant.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Oliver</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9617</link>
		<dc:creator>Oliver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 08:07:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9617</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@David Temkin:  Any chance of you filing performance bugs at http://bugs.webkit.org  ?&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@David Temkin:  Any chance of you filing performance bugs at <a href="http://bugs.webkit.org" rel="nofollow">http://bugs.webkit.org</a>  ?</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Oliver</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9616</link>
		<dc:creator>Oliver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 08:05:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9616</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@gfan: the SquirrelFish times &lt;em&gt;do&lt;/em&gt; include compilation time, it&#039;s completely unavoidable.  Tamarin is the only one for which the compile time is not included because currently the tamarin jit is unable to to run javascript itself, it requires a separate program to compile the javascript to actionscript bytecodes.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I&#039;m not sure why you believe squirrelfish times don&#039;t include that time.. in fact i&#039;m not sure why you think it is actually possible.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Finally,  SunSpider was created to find performance issues, if it did not include compilation time it would not be useful, as we would be unable to make any changes to codegen because we would not be able to measure the resultant performance (there&#039;s no point making a change that makes interpreting a script 2 seconds faster if the compilation takes 3 seconds longer).&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@gfan: the SquirrelFish times <em>do</em> include compilation time, it&#8217;s completely unavoidable.  Tamarin is the only one for which the compile time is not included because currently the tamarin jit is unable to to run javascript itself, it requires a separate program to compile the javascript to actionscript bytecodes.</p>

<p>I&#8217;m not sure why you believe squirrelfish times don&#8217;t include that time.. in fact i&#8217;m not sure why you think it is actually possible.</p>

<p>Finally,  SunSpider was created to find performance issues, if it did not include compilation time it would not be useful, as we would be unable to make any changes to codegen because we would not be able to measure the resultant performance (there&#8217;s no point making a change that makes interpreting a script 2 seconds faster if the compilation takes 3 seconds longer).</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: gfan</title>
		<link>http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/comment-page-1/#comment-9615</link>
		<dc:creator>gfan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 18:53:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.satine.org/archives/2008/06/03/squirrelfish-is-faster-than-tamarin/#comment-9615</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;For JavaScript, most of the scripts are compiled on-the-fly, so the compilation time is also very important. As David Temkin&#039;s comment above, it is more convincing if considering both compile and interpret time for SunSpider Benchmark&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For JavaScript, most of the scripts are compiled on-the-fly, so the compilation time is also very important. As David Temkin&#8217;s comment above, it is more convincing if considering both compile and interpret time for SunSpider Benchmark</p>]]></content:encoded>
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